 06-22-2009, 12:55 AM | ||||
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[quote] each species occupies a unique niche even within the same general climate, where temperature, light, humidity vary depending on the specific habitat of each species (e.g. tree vs ground dwelling, terrestrial vs. aquatic). In an unnatural situation (the terrarium), it is hard to provide an environment that closely duplicates the natural environment needed to keep single species healthy and stress-free. Providing natural conditions for multiple species is extrememly complicated.
Terrariums for mixed species generally need to be much larger than those for a single species, and are more difficult to maintain. Extra room is needed to provide the proper environmental conditions and furnishings for each species, as well as allowing each species their own space to hunt and interact somewhat naturally. Crowding different species together in a small tank can be a recipe for disaster.[\QUOTE]
I do not disagree with this statement. In fact, if you reread my earlier statement, you’ll see that I said essentially the same thing:
[quote] if the species occupy different niches AND their temp, humidity, and regions from which they come are the same, you may be able to combine them successfully. For example, I was recently told by an expert breeder of Phelsuma that species from Madagascar can sometimes be combined if one is arboreal and the other is terrestrial. Note that he said "sometimes." They must also be species that are fairly nonagressive, and there must be plenty of space such that their niches don't overlap.[\QUOTE] (underlining added for emphasis)
Of course, as Austin explicitly states, you don't want to combine a species that is carnivorous or aggressive with a smaller or more delicate species.
I used to agree wholly with the person you quoted, Alex. However, a couple of people here on Vivarium Forums began the process of opening my eyes to larger possibilities, and talking with a gecko breeder and collector just recently completed that process.
Last weekend, we had the privilege of touring the facility of what is, according to a breeder in San Diego, at least the largest collector/breeder of geckos in the nation if not in the world: Jon Boone (check out the new website he has begun at jonboone.com!). Fortunately for us, he lives only about two hours away! He currently has about 275 species of geckos with about 2000 animals (more being hatched daily)—and he mixes species successfully. He is the one who explained what I wrote above, when I asked him about putting a trio of geckos in a 75-gallon aquarium. At one point in our discussion, he suggested combining Phelsuma laticauda (arboreal, diurnal) with Anolis (a small terrestrial species, diurnal) and possibly a nocturnal or crepuscular species and explained that people underestimate the possibility of combining species due to the problems that inexperienced keepers have had; experienced keepers who know how to monitor their animals can do so successfully. The key is combining species with the same environmental needs and different habits and niches in adequate space, monitoring the animals for stress, and making appropriate adjustments to accommodate the needs the animals demonstrate.
This is not something I would recommend for an inexperienced keeper.
My DH and I had a fantastic visit with Jon, who is extremely knowledgeable, warm, and friendly (and his wife is equally warm and friendly) as we toured his stupendous collection. We saw so many different geckos that we simply cannot remember them all . . . and we are really looking forward to going back for another tour and to get some geckos of our own after we finish building not just one tank, but THREE! My DH, who until this point has merely accepted my interest in herps, loved the tour and fell in love with the desert geckos and has decided he wants some!
Now we're truly obsessed!!!
Terrariums for mixed species generally need to be much larger than those for a single species, and are more difficult to maintain. Extra room is needed to provide the proper environmental conditions and furnishings for each species, as well as allowing each species their own space to hunt and interact somewhat naturally. Crowding different species together in a small tank can be a recipe for disaster.[\QUOTE]
I do not disagree with this statement. In fact, if you reread my earlier statement, you’ll see that I said essentially the same thing:
[quote] if the species occupy different niches AND their temp, humidity, and regions from which they come are the same, you may be able to combine them successfully. For example, I was recently told by an expert breeder of Phelsuma that species from Madagascar can sometimes be combined if one is arboreal and the other is terrestrial. Note that he said "sometimes." They must also be species that are fairly nonagressive, and there must be plenty of space such that their niches don't overlap.[\QUOTE] (underlining added for emphasis)
Of course, as Austin explicitly states, you don't want to combine a species that is carnivorous or aggressive with a smaller or more delicate species.
I used to agree wholly with the person you quoted, Alex. However, a couple of people here on Vivarium Forums began the process of opening my eyes to larger possibilities, and talking with a gecko breeder and collector just recently completed that process.
Last weekend, we had the privilege of touring the facility of what is, according to a breeder in San Diego, at least the largest collector/breeder of geckos in the nation if not in the world: Jon Boone (check out the new website he has begun at jonboone.com!). Fortunately for us, he lives only about two hours away! He currently has about 275 species of geckos with about 2000 animals (more being hatched daily)—and he mixes species successfully. He is the one who explained what I wrote above, when I asked him about putting a trio of geckos in a 75-gallon aquarium. At one point in our discussion, he suggested combining Phelsuma laticauda (arboreal, diurnal) with Anolis (a small terrestrial species, diurnal) and possibly a nocturnal or crepuscular species and explained that people underestimate the possibility of combining species due to the problems that inexperienced keepers have had; experienced keepers who know how to monitor their animals can do so successfully. The key is combining species with the same environmental needs and different habits and niches in adequate space, monitoring the animals for stress, and making appropriate adjustments to accommodate the needs the animals demonstrate.
This is not something I would recommend for an inexperienced keeper.
My DH and I had a fantastic visit with Jon, who is extremely knowledgeable, warm, and friendly (and his wife is equally warm and friendly) as we toured his stupendous collection. We saw so many different geckos that we simply cannot remember them all . . . and we are really looking forward to going back for another tour and to get some geckos of our own after we finish building not just one tank, but THREE! My DH, who until this point has merely accepted my interest in herps, loved the tour and fell in love with the desert geckos and has decided he wants some!
Now we're truly obsessed!!!
| 06-22-2009, 10:19 PM | ||||
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| Alex, I wasn't offended at all, so there's no need to apologize. You were doing precisely what I did a few months ago--repeating/reporting what you (I) had learned about mixing species from others who considered it taboo. It wasn't until 1) a couple of people on this forum offered qualifiers and 2) I met Jon Boone, who really educated me about mixing species. I learned that the taboo against mixing species should hold for those who are inexperienced but can be ignored for those who are experienced and willing to put in adequate research to combine species safely. So now you are learning what I only recently learned!  |
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